Joined: Tue Feb 28 2006, 04:03PM
Location: Virginia
Posts: 39
I got the Fury licensed today, and took it out for my first ride on this beautiful 80 degree day! The thing actually runs and drives very well....I'm very happy with it. Looks like it needs some shocks and a thermostat, but that's about it. It does have manual brakes though, and if I could change one thing from "as built", power brakes would be it. What exactly is different on a '70 C body between manual drum brakes and power drums? Is the pedal and pedal assembly the same? Can I get the parts from any '70 C body or does it have to be a Plymouth? What would I need to pull from a junkyard to have absolutely correct power brakes on this '70 Fury 318 besides the booster? I know that on a B body, there are quite a few different parts involved, but I'm clueless on these big things! Overall, I love this car so far.....even had the top down and it was wonderful. Thanks Guy
You should be able to get a booster/master combo from your local parts store. Beyond that, a pedal is about it. Looking at the 69 parts book, there a different pedal, 70 is probably the same. I think my 70 Fury vert parts car has an OK pedal if you need one. This is assuming we are talking automatic.
I got a new booster/master combo for my disc conversion for about $120. I wouldn't mess with junk yard stuff, unless budget forces you to.
Joined: Tue Feb 28 2006, 04:03PM
Location: Virginia
Posts: 39
71F3 wrote ... RM what Fury is it?
It's a '70 Fury III convertible...318 automatic. The main reason I'm thinking junkyard, is that I want it to look absolutely "factory" with all the correct brackets, vacuum fittings, hardware, booster, etc. Fooling with B and E bodies so long and trying to get them as correct as possible, I lose sleep if even one bolt is wrong. I feel bad enough about even thinking about doing this...since the car was built with manual brakes. But I think it will make driving it, which is what I plan to do, considerably more enjoyable. So, I'll need to swap out just the pedal and not the whole pedal assembly that bolts to the firewall? I'd imagine the actuator rod is different also, so I guess I better borrow my buddie's 70 parts book and make a list! Guy
The rod will come with the booster. The parts store boosters I have got looked just like the ones I took off, minus the rust and crude. Brakes are one of those things I don't screw around with, New or rebuilt, never used.
So this car was manual 4 wheel drum brakes?? {cringe} if you wanted to keep the manual brakes, (not sure why) you could do the 73 disc swap. The discs would greatly improve braking. I assume you will be keeping stock wheels, so the discs wouldn't be seen.
I am not trying to be a jerk, or push you to modify like I have, but these cars are so big that brakes are the one thing you want to be totally predictable and in control of EVERYTIME!
We had rebuilt the entire system on my Fury back in 1990 with the original power 4 wheel drum setup. It helped alot from when we first bought it, but there was still alot to be desired. After doing the 73 disc swap, it actually braked like a modern car, in control everytime. I felt like I was just along for the ride to where ever it wanted to go with the 4 wheel drums. My other vert still has this setup, scares the #$@# out of me everytime I drive it!
Joined: Tue Feb 28 2006, 04:03PM
Location: Virginia
Posts: 39
I'm pretty sure I want to go to power brakes....this thing is a bear to stop....although, for some reason, it was built that way! What would be involved in going to power discs? How common were power discs on a 70 C body? Would the parts from any disc brake 70 C body bolt on? Are the rear drums on a factory disc brake car the same size and type as the rear drum on mine? I see the reference to swapping to a '73 disc setup...is that better/easier than a 70 setup? So much to learn about these things..... Thanks for the info.
Joined: Sun Feb 05 2006, 11:51PM
Location: Pa
Posts: 3064
Visit Mopar Action's web site - they have a lot of info on changing to disc brakes on the cheap, using proven methods. Plus they have a ton of tech questions answered, too.
Joined: Fri Oct 07 2005, 12:03PM
Location: Central Ky.
Posts: 1575
Disc brakes available starting 66' for C-bodies. The first were the Budd discs thru 68'.....don't even go there!
69' thru 73' setups fit & are a single-piston 11.75 rotor. Same upper balljoint for those yearsDisc or Drum. Same lower Balljoint for those years also disc or drum ( again 69-73' ). Those are the basics.
late 72' & 73' is the preferred setup for most. 69' - mid 72 (or late?, no one knows an exact cutoff ) used the 2-piece rotor & they seem to run around 120.00 a piece ( at least the last I checked around here ). late 72' & 73' they went to a unicast ( 1-piece ) rotor & those are usually around 60.00 a rotor ( again what I paid local ) hence the preference for that setup. Same style Caliper & rotor size, just a cheaper 1-piec. The thing is the bearing sizes changed on the spindles too at that point so the spindle has to be a late 72-73 spindle. The earlier 69-mid? 72' uses it's own spindle for those years.
Same A-arms used drum or disc. You'll need a Power Disc booster & Master Cylinder ( like Scott said get new/reman ) & either a correct proportioning valve for disc/drum or use the adjustable type to the rears & run the front thru a "T" to each front wheel. No prop valve available new except generic replacements. JY only.
The support plate behind the maual drum MC is most likely different from a power support plate & that would be a JY piece. I'm guessing Power Drum/Disc would be the same. I only say that cause my Power Drum plate would not accept the manual MC till I drilled new holes for the Manual setup ( I went the other way ) You might just be able to do the same.
I think I got most of it, like scott said pedal assy's are the same.
I looked in the 69 book, there might be a different support. I think I am looking at the right thing. I should have one of those also, a bit more work to get out though.
The 73 swap is very straight forward, direct bolt on, economical and makes a HUGE difference. First time we drove it after the swap I almost knocked my teeth out on the steering wheel!!
The 70 parts will brake and bolt on just as easy, but will be harder to find and the rotors are more expensive. 73 discs were standard, 70 they were still a rare option. They use the same caliper (I think) but different rotors and spindles. The 73's were used on a variety of trucks as well.
To do a factory appearing swap you will need a power disc master/booster combo (70-73 should be the same), proportioning valve ( 70-73 discs), spindles, backing plates and caliper bracket. The mounting orientation of the prop valve is slightly different. But everything will fit, don't remember having to make new lines. I recommed the 73 disc hoses, but have heard people making the drum hoses work. Calipers, rotors, bearings and seals would all be for the year of the spindles.
The ideal spindles are mid 72 and 73. 74 everything changed.
I am working on a tech articles with all the breakdowns. The pre 73 stuff is an option again now that the rotors are being remade.
There are some aftermarket front conversions, like Scarebird and SSBrake. However, no one, including the manufacturers has made any documentable claim that their brakes are better than the 73 setup. This does not include the bigger 13" rotos setups, but that sounds like it would be out for you anyway, as they require minimium of 17" wheels. The 73's require 15's, but that isn't an issue on a 70.
I have done this swap twice and there have been quite a few other swaps on here, so ask away!